View Full Version : I'm pulling a Lucas McDermott and going on a mission to...


Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 12:09 AM
Some of you guys who know me personally know that I've been planning forever to go on a mission for the LDS Church.

So, yea... I got my mission call, and I'm pulling a full blown Lucas McDermott and in a few months, I'll be leaving Netphoria for 2 years.

I got my mission call on Friday, and opened 'er up with my family and my gal Jenny waiting by eagerly.

On October 16th, I'll be leaving to serve in the Rapid City, South Dakota mission for 2 years. Even though the title is what it is, the area actually encompasses both South and North Dakota, about 1/3 of eastern Wyoming, and a slice of western Minnesota.

Pretty nuts, eh? I've been trying to find somebody who knows anything about South or North Dakota and really haven't had much luck. You know anything about those two states besides Fargo or Mount Rushmore?

Just thought I'd let you guys know what was up so you wouldn't all be too heartbroken when I said I was leavin' in a few months...

Seriously - if any of you guys have questions that I could answer about the missionary thing, fire away! I've found that there are a lot of mis-conceptions about the Mormon missionary program and the Mormon church in general. If I could clear up any bad rumors about anything, then we'd all benefit just a little bit.

-Adam

SPheart9
07-02-2002, 12:10 AM
i'll miss you, adam.


<3


give jenny my love, too.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 12:12 AM
when you get back, tell me how it feels to waste your life promoting the intangible, invisible, unknowable.

sorry, i'm not tolerant, and i hate the mormon religion. i prefer the jehovah's witnesses!

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 12:13 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
when you get back, tell me how it feels to waste your life promoting the intangible, invisible, unknowable.</font>

ask stephen hawking the same thing! teehee!

context is funny.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 12:13 AM
Hey Rach... thanks for the sweet words. You know, you just might be the winner of my little contest! Remember, I asked you where you thought I was going, and you said Illinois! I'm not 100% sure on that one quite yet, so don't get your hopes up too high... but it's possible!

Mark LeDrew
07-02-2002, 12:14 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
You know anything about those two states besides Fargo or Mount Rushmore?

</font>

Yeah, there's like 8 people there. It should be a relatively easy mission.



------------------
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/mledrew/samus.gif

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 12:17 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
Seriously - if any of you guys have questions that I could answer about the missionary thing, fire away! I've found that there are a lot of mis-conceptions about the Mormon missionary program and the Mormon church in general. If I could clear up any bad rumors about anything, then we'd all benefit just a little bit.</font>

i heard a rumor that some drunk saw an "angel" and it led him to some plates in the ground or something that had a message from god! and he destroyed the plates! is this true?

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 12:22 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
i heard a rumor that some drunk saw an "angel" and it led him to some plates in the ground or something that had a message from god! and he destroyed the plates! is this true?</font>

I know you're just trying to bring the thread down, which is kinda sad. The first attempt didn't quite make me bite, and I really don't feel like commenting on this one since you're obviously just poking at my faith.

Travis Meeks
07-02-2002, 12:23 AM
if you could answer the 10003258923828746837 questions I have about god and religon that doesn't ******* "he works in mysterious ways" or something including the word faith, please let me know

Junebug
07-02-2002, 12:25 AM
wow. Good luck. And I'll bite- are Mormons Christian? because they tell you that they are but then they believe in John Smith being the saviour which doesn't seem to go right with Jesus, if you know what I mean. Sorry to sound so ignorant but I've gotten 5 different answers from 5 different people on this and it's starting to annoy me.

Tessellation
07-02-2002, 12:28 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
Some of you guys who know me personally know that I've been planning forever to go on a mission for the LDS Church.

</font>

What an enormous waste of time.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 12:31 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
I know you're just trying to bring the thread down, which is kinda sad. The first attempt didn't quite make me bite, and I really don't feel like commenting on this one since you're obviously just poking at my faith.</font>

and christians, especially mormons, like to bring the rights of others down. that's sad.

your religion is stupid, illogical, and based on completely unreliable documents. i can't believe people who seem intelligent, like you do, fall for that shit. i'm just guessing you've had it ingrained in you since birth, though there are some intelligent people that convert to mormonism. but then, lots of intelligent people join cults, or become scientolgists.

that's all. i feel bad being so hateful of religion, and i'm sure i'm just as self-righteous as a christian is. IT MUST BE THE DEVIL MAKING ME HATE CHRISTIANITY!

Travis Meeks
07-02-2002, 12:33 AM
hmph, I'm sorry but I just believe people who believe in religon are mindless. They are taught not to question their beliefs and conform to the masses. Plus I am entirely against missions. Seeing Christians in Congo and what not makes me want to throw up. They destroy the traditions of other cultures.

Travis Meeks
07-02-2002, 12:35 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
i feel bad being so hateful of religion, </font>

really? why?
you seem so much more intelligent in doing so (not sarcastic)

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 12:41 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Travis Meeks:
really? why?
you seem so much more intelligent in doing so (not sarcastic)</font>

i just do. there's no way you can change someone's mind on religion, they've either been brainwashed or have brainwashed themselves.

:-/

Graveflower
07-02-2002, 12:43 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">lots of intelligent people join cults, or become scientolgists.</font>

Difference?

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 12:45 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Graveflower:
Difference?</font>

scientology is every bit as valid as christianity. i just thought i would drive home the point about how religion is stupid by mentioning the fact that people actually believe scientology.

Oblivious
07-02-2002, 12:56 AM
i think it's cool that you're willing to devote so much time to your beliefs and i think it's commendable to be so dedicated to your religion. i personally am a devote athiest but i can respect the fact that there ARE people with sincere beliefs. especially when there seems to be so much hypocrisy in the world of theology these days.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 01:16 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Junebug:
I'll bite- are Mormons Christian?</font>

That's a great question... one I get asked pretty frequently by friends, co-workers, and what-not. Seriously, thank you for asking so that I can clear it up for you.

Yes, Mormons are Christians. Somehow people get this idea (maybe from members in your case?) that we believe that Joseph Smith is our Savior. Just like all Christians, we believe that Jesus Christ is the one and only Savior. We believe that Joseph Smith is a Prophet like Moses, Abraham, or any other of the Biblical prophets of old - and that Joseph was the first in a line of modern-day prophets.

Here are a few links with quotes from leaders of our Church that put it a little bit more eloquently than I could.

http://www.mormon.org/question/faq/category/answer/0,9777,1601-1-55-2,00.html

http://www.mormon.org/question/faq/category/answer/0,9777,1601-1-56-2,00.html

Did that help?

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 01:17 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Travis Meeks:
if you could answer the 10003258923828746837 questions I have about god and religon that doesn't ******* "he works in mysterious ways" or something including the word faith, please let me know</font>

If you'd like to ask a few of those, I'd be happy to try and give you my feelings on them. Can't say that I could answer any or all of them, but I guess it couldn't hurt...

Graveflower
07-02-2002, 01:19 AM
What exactly does LDS stand for? Seriously. I'm too lazy to look it up.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 01:27 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
and christians, especially mormons, like to bring the rights of others down.</font>

Not asking this with a sarcastic or rude tone at all... but what do you mean by that? Maybe I could clear it up?

<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
i'm just guessing you've had it ingrained in you since birth, though there are some intelligent people that convert to mormonism.</font>

I have been a member since I was born. My mom is a convert, and my dad has been a member since he was born. So I suppose that I have had it ingrained in me since I was a little guy.

However, there comes a point when investing as much time into something as our religion does (or any religion, for that matter) that you want to figure it out for yourself, and find the truth. If I didn't truly and sincerely believe, I don't think that I would invest all of the time that I do put into going to Church.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 01:29 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Graveflower:
What exactly does LDS stand for? Seriously. I'm too lazy to look it up.</font>

It's an abbreviation, and not a very good one at that. Not quite sure why it's as hip as it is.

But it's the abbreviation for "Latter Day Saints" which is part of the official name of our church, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

funnygeezus
07-02-2002, 01:37 AM
<font color=slate>so what does a "mission" for the lds church involve exactly? i can't see it being a humanitarian deal, seeing as how you're going to the dakotas (but you never know). this is a serious question. maybe i should already know, but i have no idea what kind of mission you speak of. please just tell me it doesn't it involve going door-to-door and badgering people into converting.

------------------
And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
Power hath descended forth from thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out thy command.
So we shall flow a river forth to thee, and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
In nomine patri, et fili, et spiritu sancti.
http://www.avalon.nf.ca/~rosemd/we3.jpg

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 01:38 AM
Wake up man. You're in a cult, selling Jesus. People come to their beliefs on their own. Selling your religion is wrong.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 01:43 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
Not asking this with a sarcastic or rude tone at all... but what do you mean by that? Maybe I could clear it up?</font>

nevermind my ignorant inflammatory statements, but godammit, you're so polite. are you polite because you're naturally so cool and unemotional, or because you're holding back and you want to act nice?

Junebug
07-02-2002, 01:44 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:

Did that help?</font>

Yes it did. Thank you. My friend is mormon and we don't discuss it much, but I've always gotten the notion from her that Joseph (not John, sorry) Smith was The Savior. Thanks for the clarification, and good luck on your mission.

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 01:44 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
nevermind my ignorant inflammatory statements, but godammit, you're so polite. are you polite because you're naturally so cool and unemotional, or because you're holding back and you want to act nice?</font>

Obviously you didn't visit the Olympics this year.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 01:46 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
Obviously you didn't visit the Olympics this year.</font>

no, but someday i'll go to utah to see the sundance festival. oh wait, that's in colorado. nevermind. i'm never going to utah. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/smile.gif

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 01:48 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
no, but someday i'll go to utah to see the sundance festival. oh wait, that's in colorado. nevermind. i'm never going to utah. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/smile.gif</font>

No it's not. The Aspen Film Festival is in Colorado.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 01:48 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
No it's not. The Aspen Film Festival is in Colorado. </font>

oh yeah? so is sundance in utah? good, then i was right in the first place.

So very sad about me
07-02-2002, 01:52 AM
do you really believe that gordon hinkley had a vision about where you should go on your mission??

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 01:55 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by So very sad about me:
do you really believe that gordon hinkley had a vision about where you should go on your mission??

</font>

Come on. He's the fucking Mormon Yoda. Of course he did.

*meditates*

GO TO SOUTH DAKOTA, YOU MUST!

Oblivious
07-02-2002, 01:58 AM
sundance is in wyoming? i think. i think i remember it being in the vicinity of devil's tower.

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 02:00 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Oblivious:
sundance is in wyoming? i think. i think i remember it being in the vicinity of devil's tower.</font>

Okay, knock it off.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:01 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Oblivious:
sundance is in wyoming? i think. i think i remember it being in the vicinity of devil's tower.</font>

devil's tower is in idaho.

Oblivious
07-02-2002, 02:04 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
devil's tower is in idaho.</font>

well, when you're driving through there it all looks the same. everything kinda blends together. except for the no speed limit thing in montana. i think it was montana. or was that south dakota? http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/confused.gif

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:06 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Oblivious:
well, when you're driving through there it all looks the same. everything kinda blends together. except for the no speed limit thing in montana. i think it was montana. or was that south dakota? http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/confused.gif</font>

i think that was oregon.

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 02:06 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
devil's tower is in idaho.</font>

STOP IT! IT IS IN WYOMING!

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 02:08 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
i think that was oregon.</font>

As general board moderator, I am stripping you of your powers.

Oblivious
07-02-2002, 02:08 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
STOP IT! IT IS IN WYOMING!</font>

i knew i was right! sundance is in wyoming too RIGHT?!?!

General Board Moderator
07-02-2002, 02:10 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Oblivious:
i knew i was right! sundance is in wyoming too RIGHT?!?!</font>

You kids. You don't even know how close I am to becoming a Linkin Park song right now.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:10 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
STOP IT! IT IS IN WYOMING!</font>

wyoming is in canada.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:11 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
As general board moderator, I am stripping you of your powers.</font>

you'd have to be admin for that, dorkus.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:11 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
You kids. You don't even know how close I am to becoming a Linkin Park song right now.</font>

linkin park sings that song "break stuff" right?

Mayfuck
07-02-2002, 02:11 AM
Ryan Patrick, you fucking idiot.

There.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:12 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Mayfuck:
Ryan Patrick, you fucking idiot.

There.</font>

whaaaaaaaaat.

Oblivious
07-02-2002, 02:12 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by General Board Moderator:
You kids. You don't even know how close I am to becoming a Linkin Park song right now.</font>

BUT WE NEED TO BE EDUCATED. IF YOU CAN NOT DEAL WITH THAT RESPONSIBILITY THAN WHY DID YOU TAKE ON THE ROLE OF MODERATOR?!?!?!

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 02:23 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Oblivious:
i think it's cool that you're willing to devote so much time to your beliefs and i think it's commendable to be so dedicated to your religion. i personally am a devote athiest but i can respect the fact that there ARE people with sincere beliefs. especially when there seems to be so much hypocrisy in the world of theology these days. </font>

Thank you very much. I really mean it... thanks. It sometimes feels like people today with sincere, honest beliefs get lost in the shuffle.


[This message has been edited by Raskolnikov (edited 07-02-2002).]

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 02:24 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
It sometimes feels like people today with sincere, honest beliefs get lost in the shuffle.</font>

yeah, i feel bad for those 3 people.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 02:58 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
are you polite because you're naturally so cool and unemotional, or because you're holding back and you want to act nice?</font>

I really don't feel like I'm holding anything back by responding the way I am... so maybe it's my character.

But when I started this post, I knew there'd be a discussion about it, that's partially why I did. I know that there are other intelligent people on this board, and I figured that if I went in very calm and level headed, then I could answer some questions.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 03:07 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by funnygeezus:
<font color=slate>so what does a "mission" for the lds church involve exactly? i can't see it being a humanitarian deal, seeing as how you're going to the dakotas (but you never know). maybe i should already know, but i have no idea what kind of mission you speak of. please just tell me it doesn't it involve going door-to-door and badgering people into converting.
</font>

I know it's cornball to cut and paste, but here is an answer to that one...

"Missionaries teach the gospel to those who are interested. They also perform community service. Some missionaries have special assignments to assist with health, welfare, or other needs." [from www.mormon.org] (http://www.mormon.org])

I think the key phrase there is "those who are interested". If we do meet somebody on the street and they want to talk to us, then we'll strike up a conversation and go. If they don't want to, then we're not about to poke 'em in the arm and follow them down the street.

A lot of the people that I'll be teaching somehow requested more info on our religion - maybe they saw the above mentioned web-page, talked to their neighbor, or somethin' like that. So in that regard, it's follow-up work to teach people that have previously expressed an interest.

Not sure if that's what you wanted to hear or not, but... yea.

tear stained glass
07-02-2002, 03:07 AM
Here's a few questions: 1) Is this "mission" compulsory for all Mormons? 2) If it is, do you think this is a fair thing to force young Mormons to do? (I mean, you know how there are lukewarm Catholics, so-to-speak? Or are there not any Mormons like that?)

tweedyburd
07-02-2002, 03:15 AM
Oh, I just love the snobbery.

Yeah, you're such a fuckin' idiot for selflessly devoting your time toward things like health care and community service, regardless of your motivation. HOW IGNERNT OF U!!@#$

I, for one, wish you luck.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 03:17 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Travis Meeks:
Seeing Christians in Congo and what not makes me want to throw up. They destroy the traditions of other cultures.</font>

I was just doing some reading, and found something that pointed directly to this issue, thought I'd share.

"Missionaries are instructed to have the deepest respect for the laws and customs of the countries where they serve and to respect the right of each person to determine how they will worship." [From www.mormon.org] (http://www.mormon.org])

As you can see, it is by no mean the intention and I believe that it's not the end result. We're extremely concencious of other people's cultures/traditions and try to accept their beliefs and not trample their lifestyle.

<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Travis Meeks:
They are taught not to question their beliefs and conform to the masses.</font>

One of the main points of our religion is that we believe in personal revelation. This way, each member may have a very personal and intimate testimony of the truthfulness of our Church. It may be contrary to your thoughts about religion on the whole, but we are actually encouraged to question the truthfulness of the Gospel, pray about it, and come to a personal knowledge of it's truthfulness.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 03:24 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by tear stained glass:
Here's a few questions: 1) Is this "mission" compulsory for all Mormons? 2) If it is, do you think this is a fair thing to force young Mormons to do? (I mean, you know how there are lukewarm Catholics, so-to-speak? Or are there not any Mormons like that?)</font>

Also definately should be on the Mormon Mission SPFC FAQ. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/biggrin.gif

Seriously, though... I bet there are others askin' this same question right now. It is completely voluntary - we aren't paid for it, or even compensated for that matter. If somebody who wishes to serve but can't financially do it, then there are ways to get it covered, but generally it's self-funded.

Of course it's encouraged, but it's literally impossible to force somebody to give up 2 years of their life and do something like this.

Moreso, if they did force kids to go out there and do this, then how effective would it be? Half the people out there would be trying, and the other half would be out there pickin' their noses. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/biggrin.gif

As for the luke-warm issue, as with any faith, there are members who aren't fully into it. But generally with Mormonism, the members who are there are devout. It's definately not an easy lifestyle to live, and sometimes it's not a very fun one.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 03:27 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by tweedyburd:

I, for one, wish you luck.</font>

Thanks. I'm totally stoked to go, South Dakota isn't the most foriegn place in the world, but I'm still very nervous. I'll need all the luck I can get.

funnygeezus
07-02-2002, 03:30 AM
<font color=slate>after visiting the webpage i have some more questions:
1) do you REALLY pay a tithe? 10 percent of whatever you make seems a bit steep...
2) i can understand (but not necessarily agree with) banning alcohol, tabacco and illegal drugs, but no coffee or tea, wtf? what's the reasoning there? is it that the church views caffeine as an addictive drug (and maybe rightly so)? if so are soda drinks (and other foods and drinks that contain caffeine) ok?
3) as i understand it, you pay for the mission yourself, and spend your prime working time (presumably) doing your mission work. how then do you pay for your living expenses? did you save up for this? do you work a part/full time job(s) in addition to your missionary work? does the church pay you a salary?

------------------
And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee.
Power hath descended forth from thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out thy command.
So we shall flow a river forth to thee, and teeming with souls shall it ever be.
In nomine patri, et fili, et spiritu sancti.
http://www.avalon.nf.ca/~rosemd/we3.jpg

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 03:44 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
But when I started this post, I knew there'd be a discussion about it, that's partially why I did. I know that there are other intelligent people on this board, and I figured that if I went in very calm and level headed, then I could answer some questions.</font>

admittedly, there are lots of misconceptions about the mormon faith. i was curious once about how it works, since there aren't really any mormons around here. so i had read about it before. most people only know what they've heard in passing.

i just completely disagree with the mormon religion, and religion in general. also, i'm very moody.

you're so clean and polished, you sound like a salesman, not the pushy kind, but the matter of fact kind. really, i never hear people so polite and meek.

BeautifulLoser
07-02-2002, 06:26 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
and christians, especially mormons, like to bring the rights of others down. that's sad.

your religion is stupid, illogical, and based on completely unreliable documents. i can't believe people who seem intelligent, like you do, fall for that shit. i'm just guessing you've had it ingrained in you since birth, though there are some intelligent people that convert to mormonism. but then, lots of intelligent people join cults, or become scientolgists.

that's all. i feel bad being so hateful of religion, and i'm sure i'm just as self-righteous as a christian is. IT MUST BE THE DEVIL MAKING ME HATE CHRISTIANITY!</font>

It's not very healthy to be that angry. You need a hug. don't worry, Jesus loves you.

------------------
Originally posted by Irrelevant:
EAT A BAG OF FUCK (http://www.livejournal.com/users/beautifulloser), HOMOLOVER.

http://216.40.201.38/contrib/ruinkai/screama.gif

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 06:34 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by BeautifulLoser:
It's not very healthy to be that angry. You need a hug. don't worry, Jesus loves you.</font>

god made you fat!

BeautifulLoser
07-02-2002, 06:38 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
god made you fat!</font>

I'm not fat... I'm just blessed with hips. Good for having kids and all that...

------------------
Originally posted by Irrelevant:
EAT A BAG OF FUCK (http://www.livejournal.com/users/beautifulloser), HOMOLOVER.

http://216.40.201.38/contrib/ruinkai/screama.gif

wangcomputers
07-02-2002, 06:47 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:

you're so clean and polished, you sound like a salesman, not the pushy kind, but the matter of fact kind. really, i never hear people so polite and meek.</font>

I'm not religious, but I don't have anything against religions.
If they enforce morals and civility, then i think it’s a shame more people aren’t involved.

I don't think religious causes are a waste of time. The importance of Religious ideals aren't just about believing in life after death, or a saviour, they teach the importance of conscionable behaviour; something which is sadly lacking from the obnoxious atheists evident in this thread.

Travis Meeks
07-02-2002, 09:33 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by wangcomputers:


they teach the importance of conscionable behaviour; something which is sadly lacking from the obnoxious atheists evident in this thread.</font>

Jihad?
Inquisition?
little boys getting their wieners played with?
Israel?

Obnoxious atheists? Just because we don't believe in religion as strongly as some people do believe in it doesn't mean we're obnoxious. I don't believe any of us atheist in the thread are evil, we have morals, they're just based on humanity and civil rights, not so that we can sit next to Jesus and Sinatra on a cloud.

wangcomputers
07-02-2002, 10:30 AM
i think there's more conceit in society now that the strength of religion has faded, due to logistics and scientific advances.
the fact is, most people need to believe that there are repercussions for deviant behaviour, to prevent them from doing what they want.

ideally there would be no such thing as religion, but i think it's human nature for theism to be created as a form of control and unification, but consequently it also leads to separation from those of differing faith.

Most of the modern humanitarian notions of morality would not exist without the centuries of religious underpinning. That isn’t to say that there isn’t an inherent code for morality.

is stealing wrong just because it is stated as such in the ten commandments? I doubt it, considering that even my dog decided to bite me when I tried to take his treats away, the repercussions I faced were to be bitten... But for people, now that we no longer think we’re going to hell because if it, the only thing stopping us is the law.
But the law doesn’t cover all unconscionable behaviour, it doesn’t really stop you from being an asshole, does it?

You imply that religion is bad because of people fighting for their ‘promised land’, but can you say that war would not exist otherwise? I would argue that it's human(animal) nature to be territorial, and confrontational, and religion is more of a regulatory system which sets boundaries.
Such boundaries that wouldn’t hurt to be reinforced in this case.<font color=black>

[This message has been edited by wangcomputers (edited 07-02-2002).]

So very sad about me
07-02-2002, 10:39 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Travis Meeks:

little boys getting their wieners played with?


</font>


I can't wait for the new south park http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/biggrin.gif

The Gaddrow
07-02-2002, 10:44 AM
Adam, I would just like to say that the whole concept is entirely fucking nuts.

That being said, I admire you for some strange reason, and always have. I have always thought of you as one of my favorite posters here, always able to add a new perspective, and possibly open my eyes to something I had not seen before. Weather I agree with you or not, you have always expressed your opinions in a manner often unseen around here. I wish you and Jenny the best of luck and good fortune.<font color=black><font size=1>

[This message has been edited by The Gaddrow (edited 07-02-2002).]

Kilgore Trout
07-02-2002, 11:21 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by wangcomputers:
i think there's more conceit in society now that the strength of religion has faded, due to logistics and scientific advances.
the fact is, most people need to believe that there are repercussions for deviant behaviour, to prevent them from doing what they want.

ideally there would be no such thing as religion, but i think it's human nature for theism to be created as a form of control and unification, but consequently it also leads to separation from those of differing faith.

Most of the modern humanitarian notions of morality would not exist without the centuries of religious underpinning. That isn’t to say that there isn’t an inherent code for morality.

is stealing wrong just because it is stated as such in the ten commandments? I doubt it, considering that even my dog decided to bite me when I tried to take his treats away, the repercussions I faced were to be bitten... But for people, now that we no longer think we’re going to hell because if it, the only thing stopping us is the law.
But the law doesn’t cover all unconscionable behaviour, it doesn’t really stop you from being an asshole, does it?

You imply that religion is bad because of people fighting for their ‘promised land’, but can you say than war would not exist otherwise? I would argue that it's human(animal) nature to be territorial, and confrontational, and religion is more of a regulatory system which sets boundaries.
Such boundaries that wouldn’t hurt to be reinforced in this case.<font color=black>

[This message has been edited by wangcomputers (edited 07-02-2002).]</font>

If you wrote that that's pretty good.

scouse_dave
07-02-2002, 11:46 AM
my question: what will happen to me when i die if i don't believe in jesus/the LDS doctrine?

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 12:54 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by funnygeezus:
<font color=slate>after visiting the webpage i have some more questions:
1) do you REALLY pay a tithe? 10 percent of whatever you make seems a bit steep...
2) i can understand (but not necessarily agree with) banning alcohol, tabacco and illegal drugs, but no coffee or tea, wtf? what's the reasoning there? is it that the church views caffeine as an addictive drug (and maybe rightly so)? if so are soda drinks (and other foods and drinks that contain caffeine) ok?
3) as i understand it, you pay for the mission yourself, and spend your prime working time (presumably) doing your mission work. how then do you pay for your living expenses? did you save up for this? do you work a part/full time job(s) in addition to your missionary work? does the church pay you a salary?
</font>

All good questions... here we go. Beware... long answers ahead.

1.) Yes, I do pay a full tithe, 10% of my income. I'm not gonna lie to you, it is a tough thing to do sometimes. But I honestly believe that one of the reasons why I'm so financially blessed is because I've been honest with my tithing.

A lot of people criticize our Church 'cause we've got a lot of money. But one thing that I need to underscore is that we do not have a paid clergy. Our local leaders who probably volunteer 40 hours of their time (or more) a week aren't paid for any of it. Most of them have familes, and full time jobs to boot. So it's not like the 10% I pay from my check is going into a slush fund somewhere for clergy members' paychecks.

That 10% goes to build new meetinghouses, temples, and service those buildings all around the globe. The church also has a number of other programs that members can choose to donate towards, such as a large scale humanitarian fund, and a recent addition to the Church's programs is called the Perpetual Education Fund. Off-topic, but I'll explain it anyways.

Say that there's a 20 year old guy much like me who decides to go on a mission. The only difference is that he lives in the middle of a literal jungle in Brazil. He has no real education, and no real way to support himself once he returns, so while he's serving his mission in New York, he's covered for and is happy. However, upon returning home, he finds himself stuck in the same spot that he was before he left. Church members have started a rotating fund to loan money to kids like him so that they can go to school somewhere, learn a trade, and hopefully start to break the poverty cycle. Once they've got their skills, they pay back the loan and go forward. The money is then loaned out to the next person in another part of the world, helping once more to enrich the community where the person lives, and teach the person a valuable trade. I think it's a great system, and something that a lot of other religions and/or service organizations could follow suit on.

2. All of your facts on our health code, called the Word of Wisdom, are correct. We don't smoke, drink alcohol, coffee, tea, or do illegal drugs. As for the caffeine issue, you're also correct. The Church dosen't have an official stance on caffinated soft drinks, simply because the revelation regarding the Word of Wisdom was given in the year 1833, when Jolt Cola wasn't around. It is left up to personal choice, many members choose not to drink any sort of caffeine. I drink Coke and what-not, and I admire the members who don't drink caffeine. You can read the Word of Wisdom in it's entirety here:

http://scriptures.lds.org/dc/89

3.) Being a missionary is a literal full-time job from 6:00 AM until 9:00 PM. Many people wonder if we work part time jobs or something to support ourselves when we're out there, but we do not. Missions are generally self-funded. However, there are donation funds set up to assist missionaries who need financial support. I will be paying for a portion of it, and my parents will be funding the rest. It's really not as expensive as one would think, seeing how living costs are reduced because you split a lot of it with other missionaries.

Geeze, those were really long-winded answers... probably will spur a few more questions. Hope those helped.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 12:57 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
admittedly, there are lots of misconceptions about the mormon faith. i was curious once about how it works, since there aren't really any mormons around here. so i had read about it before. most people only know what they've heard in passing.

you're so clean and polished, you sound like a salesman, not the pushy kind, but the matter of fact kind. really, i never hear people so polite and meek.</font>

Thanks for being an intelligent human being and doing research on something to draw your own conclusions. 99/100 people only know all of the cliches about Mormons and go from there.

And as for the salesman comment... thanks there, too.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 01:19 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by The Gaddrow:

That being said, I admire you for some strange reason, and always have. I have always thought of you as one of my favorite posters here, always able to add a new perspective, and possibly open my eyes to something I had not seen before. Weather I agree with you or not, you have always expressed your opinions in a manner often unseen around here.</font>

Mike, let me tell you that the feeling is totally mutual. It's exactly the way you put it- I'm not quite sure why, but I admire you for that same strange reason you admire me. Thanks for the kind words.
<font color=black><font size=1>



[This message has been edited by Raskolnikov (edited 07-02-2002).]

wangcomputers
07-02-2002, 01:41 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Kilgore Trout:
If you wrote that that's pretty good.</font>

i did thanks.

AndySlash
07-02-2002, 02:28 PM
I was in Cambridge, England a couple months ago searching for Pink Floyd landmarks and was approached by a young lady who was about my age. When she spoke she did not have a British accent, so I asked were she was from, and she said Virginia. It turns out she was doing her service over there, which I found surprising.

We had a pleasant conversation (which she did an impressive job of turning back to god every minute or so- I made it a game for myself to get the conversation away from religion, but I lost) discussing various things including my lackadaisical attitude toward religion (do they have a name for someone who just doesn't care about religion whatsoever?), and she was very respectful of my 'beliefs', which was a first in my dealings with 'religion salesmen'.

I sure hope you take her attitude- she was very kind and unobtrusive, but did what was asked of her. If you do, you'll definitely make a better name for those who are considered 'religion salesman' by the general pulic. Good luck.

[This message has been edited by AndySlash (edited 07-02-2002).]

sawdust restaurants
07-02-2002, 02:34 PM
Adam, we've never really conversed, but I've always found you to be one of the most polite, intelligent and level-headed people on these boards, and it's a genuine shame that you're going to be leaving. So, I wish you the best of luck, and thanks for all the info--I might not agree with all the religious aspects of what you're doing, but I admire you for having the fortitude to stick to your guns and for doing it in the most compassionate, respectful way possible. That's rare nowadays, and somewhat extraordinary.

DeviousJ
07-02-2002, 03:46 PM
Good luck man - I hope you learn and grow from the experience. Does this mean you get a netphoria blackout a la Lucas?

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 04:59 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by AndySlash:
I sure hope you take her attitude- she was very kind and unobtrusive, but did what was asked of her. If you do, you'll definitely make a better name for those who are considered 'religion salesman' by the general pulic. Good luck. </font>

Interesting story... do you know what faith she was? If she was alone, then she wasn't a Mormon- our missionaries are always in pairs. I know what you mean, though... it shows talent in a missionary when they can share their message without shoving a bible in your face... that attitude towards it just isn't in my character.

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 05:02 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by DeviousJ:
Good luck man - I hope you learn and grow from the experience. Does this mean you get a netphoria blackout a la Lucas?</font>

Yes, it does... but my girlfriend back home in Michigan will probably give Adam updates every now and then. I really don't know how much action there will be to report, but I'm sure she'll do it.

Maybe I'll even pull a Lucas and peek my head in every now and then.

AndySlash
07-02-2002, 05:07 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
Interesting story... do you know what faith she was?
</font>

Yes, I meant to say she was a LDS (the whole reason I mention the story was because of this), and she did have a companion, but she stood off in the distance- again, a sign of respect in my eyes.

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 05:20 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
Thanks for being an intelligent human being and doing research on something to draw your own conclusions. 99/100 people only know all of the cliches about Mormons and go from there.</font>

i may be intelligent (probably not) but i'm still intolerant.

here's a question: do mormons have an active role in government and voting?

Raskolnikov
07-02-2002, 05:38 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
here's a question: do mormons have an active role in government and voting?</font>

In the early days of our Church, we were persecuted horribly - angry mobs, tar & feathers, you name it. We were ran out of state after state after state, with a governent issued "extermination order" giving people the right to "exterminate" us like animals. Eventually it got so bad that while Joseph Smith was imprisioned in Carthage, IL, an angry mob broke in and murdered both him and his brother, Hyrum. That's what prompted us to make the trek across the country to start colonizing Utah.

We believe very strongly in voicing our opinions at the polls and are encouraged frequently by our local and top leaders to vote so that nobody in our country ever falls under that or any sort of persecution.

I should also mention as a caveat to that - they don't tell us what to vote for. That's also a key point to our stance on religion, that as with all things in life, we've got our own agency to choose who or what we want to vote for.

<font color=black><font size=1>


[This message has been edited by Raskolnikov (edited 07-02-2002).]

[This message has been edited by Raskolnikov (edited 07-02-2002).]

Irrelevant
07-02-2002, 06:07 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Raskolnikov:
In the early days of our Church, we were persecuted horribly - angry mobs, tar & feathers, you name it. We were ran out of state after state after state, with a governent issued "extermination order" giving people the right to "exterminate" us like animals. Eventually it got so bad that while Joseph Smith was imprisioned in Carthage, IL, an angry mob broke in and murdered both him and his brother, Hyrum. That's what prompted us to make the trek across the country to start colonizing Utah.

We believe very strongly in voicing our opinions at the polls and are encouraged frequently by our local and top leaders to vote so that nobody in our country ever falls under that or any sort of persecution.

I should also mention as a caveat to that - they don't tell us what to vote for. That's also a key point to our stance on religion, that as with all things in life, we've got our own agency to choose who or what we want to vote for.</font>

that's too bad. i mean, there shouldn't be such persecution. but still, i like jehovah's witnesses better, because they don't vote. i'm sure my friend quoted me scripture as to why they don't.

[This message has been edited by Irrelevant (edited 07-02-2002).]

Marmeladov
07-03-2002, 01:05 AM
Adam - you are such an amazing person! As I read this thread, I gained an entirely new appreciation for your humility and the strength of your testimony. Don't ever doubt your ability - you are going to be the BEST missionary that South Dakota has ever seen! I love you and I'm so proud of you.

Mark LeDrew
07-03-2002, 01:54 AM
If you know anything about the aliens they are hiding down at the Granite Mountain facility, I'd like to hear about it. Also, can you tell us anything about that Jesus cloning project? Thanks.

relaxor!
07-03-2002, 01:57 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Mark LeDrew:
If you know anything about the aliens they are hiding down at the Granite Mountain facility, I'd like to hear about it. Also, can you tell us anything about that Jesus cloning project? Thanks.</font>

w0rd

tootsie
07-03-2002, 01:59 AM
no motherfucking thank you.

ive left the lds faith and i dont plan on coming back.

good luck tho!

oh and i think is hould clear up that they (missionaries) arent doing any educating/community volunteering. they might do some, but the majority of the time is knocking on doors and such and getting people to learn about and join the church.

[This message has been edited by tootsie (edited 07-03-2002).]

Irrelevant
07-03-2002, 03:07 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Mark LeDrew:
If you know anything about the aliens they are hiding down at the Granite Mountain facility, I'd like to hear about it. Also, can you tell us anything about that Jesus cloning project? Thanks.</font>

hah. really, why are there scientists in a LDS records facility? why is there is a laboratory?

Raskolnikov
07-03-2002, 04:09 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Irrelevant:
hah. really, why are there scientists in a LDS records facility? why is there is a laboratory?</font>

All I know about the Granite Mountain area is that it's a record storing place. Our Church has one (if not the) of the largest collections of genological records anywhere on the Earth. The work that's been put into it is immense- people all across the globe have contributed to it, and people from all across the world travel to Utah to access the databases. Naturally, they want those records to be completely safe.

They also store records of important church documents, like date records of people who have been baptized. As for it storing religious artifacts, I've never heard anything about that.

To my knowledge, there's no labratory or anything of the sort there. If you could find me a source (besides that guy on the message board who's seen one too many episodes of X-Files, in my opinion) where it tells that there's a lab section of the facility, then my curiosity would be just as sparked as yours would be.

I'm not gonna lie to you - when I read that post and saw the photos, my curiosity was definately sparked. I read the whole post and was just as interested as everybody else. I don't think the cave with that tank door that he found was hooked up to the GMF at all, I think it's just an old mine shaft.

I definately wanna learn more, and I'm planning on reading all I can about the place, but not from urban explorers.

[shrugs]

Raskolnikov
07-03-2002, 04:11 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by sawdust restaurants:
Adam, we've never really conversed, but I've always found you to be one of the most polite, intelligent and level-headed people on these boards...</font>

Hey, thanks a lot. It's cool to know that I'm noticed. Drop me a PM and we'll chat a little bit... I don't even know your name.