View Full Version : fat people to pay for two seats on southwest airlines


failure
06-19-2002, 08:55 PM
(CNN) -- Southwest Airlines says it will begin enforcing a 22-year-old policy next week when it routinely charges large passengers for a second seat on its flights.

Starting June 26, Southwest passengers who are booked on full flights and need seat belt extensions, or whose bodies extend beyond the 18 3/4 inch cushions, will be required to purchase a second seat, said Christine Turneabe-Connelly, a Southwest spokeswoman.

"It's a policy that has been in place since 1980," Turneabe-Connelly said. "Over the years, we allowed some flexibility with the agents at the time of check-in. As of June 26, we will be consistent."

After examining the impact of the policy during the last few years, the airline's managers determined the flexibility created inconsistency and caused more stress for passengers and gate agents than it eliminated, Turneabe-Connelly said.

Gate agents might not have asked large passengers to purchase second seats on their outbound, partially-full Wednesday flight, but then those same people would get slammed with an extra fee on the overbooked Friday afternoon return flight.

Scenarios like that exacerbated tenuous interactions between employees and "people of size," Turneabe-Connelly said. "It's already a very difficult and sensitive issue to address."

All of Southwest's flights offer coach-sized seating. Business and first-class seats do not exist. And the "people of size" policy only applies to full flights where a larger person would not have access to an empty seat.

If a larger person required a second seat on an already full flight, then the flight would go into an oversell situation, and the crew would ask for volunteers to give up their seats, Turneabe-Connelly said.

The policy does not necessarily mean large people will pay double fares. If a person bought a ticket within the 14-day advance purchase window and knew they needed extra space, then that passenger would buy two tickets at that discounted fee.

However, if a person was buying a full-price ticket at the last minute for business or bereavement reasons, one seat would sell for the higher, walk-up fare, and the second one at the 14-day advance purchase price, Turneabe-Connelly said.

If a passenger buys a second seat and the plane is subsequently not full, passengers may get a refund. That too, Turneabe-Connelly said, has been the airline's policy since 1980.

The policy is really to ensure the comfort of all passengers, said Beth Harbin, a Southwest spokeswoman. Complaints from people of size have been rare, she said. Most complaints have come from people who felt discomforted by sitting next to larger passengers.

Salena Child
06-19-2002, 09:11 PM
it's about time, i hate being squished by fatties in airplanes!

TiaraGurl
06-19-2002, 09:33 PM
I seem to remember some guy suing another airline over this kind of thing at some point.


I had 22 shares of southwest stock but sold it over the weekend-which was not related to this.

kypper
06-19-2002, 09:35 PM
As well they should.
Obesity can be controlled; if you require 2 seats, then you pay for not correcting your health issue.

SPZero
06-19-2002, 10:09 PM
thats how it should be! I dont want someone with more rolls than a bakery on me the whole flight.

MisterSquishyHalo
06-19-2002, 10:16 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Salena Child:
it's about time, i hate being squished by fatties in airplanes!</font>

Your still going to get squished, because it just means a fat person will try and squeeze into one seat, rather than lounge into 2. heh.

MisterSquishyHalo
06-19-2002, 10:17 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
As well they should.
Obesity can be controlled; if you require 2 seats, then you pay for not correcting your health issue.</font>

Obesity is also a genetic issue, not just a health issue.

kypper
06-19-2002, 10:19 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by MisterSquishyHalo:
Obesity is also a genetic issue, not just a health issue.</font>

But even if it's genetic, it can be overcome. Predisposition just means they aren't allowed to be lazy. I'm sorry, but I don't respect people who fuck (or allow the fucking of) their bodies like that.

misho
06-19-2002, 10:21 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by MisterSquishyHalo:
Obesity is also a genetic issue, not just a health issue.</font>

who cares about genetic issues?

MisterSquishyHalo
06-19-2002, 10:25 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by misho:
who cares about genetic issues?

</font>

Obviouslly you dont heh.

melancholia
06-19-2002, 11:17 PM
i can't see how they can do this legally. the US government sees morbid obesity as a disability, and forcing heavier people to pay extra to sit on a plane is in direct violation of the Americans with Disibilities Act. I'm sure there will be lawsuits

My grandmother is a large woman... size 24. And she requires a seat belt extention when flying...but the reason for her obesity is the medication she's on that keeps her alive... it is unfair to treat people with a problem differently.

kypper
06-19-2002, 11:31 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by melancholia:
i can't see how they can do this legally. the US government sees morbid obesity as a disability, and forcing heavier people to pay extra to sit on a plane is in direct violation of the Americans with Disibilities Act. I'm sure there will be lawsuits

My grandmother is a large woman... size 24. And she requires a seat belt extention when flying...but the reason for her obesity is the medication she's on that keeps her alive... it is unfair to treat people with a problem differently. </font>

It is when it means that that's one less ticket in profit for the airlines because (most) of these people haven't gotten their weight under control by living a healthier lifestyle.

FearFactory
06-20-2002, 12:20 AM
<font color="orange">The only elephant that should be flying is Dumbo.
</font>

sawdust restaurants
06-20-2002, 12:26 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
It is when it means that that's one less ticket in profit for the airlines because (most) of these people haven't gotten their weight under control by living a healthier lifestyle.</font>

It doesn't matter. There will be lawsuits. The airlines will lose. I guarantee you this will be found to be in direct violation of the ADA.

kypper
06-20-2002, 12:28 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by sawdust restaurants:
It doesn't matter. There will be lawsuits. The airlines will lose. I guarantee you this will be found to be in direct violation of the ADA.</font>

Which is fucking pathetic. It is not your right to have other people suffer because you can't stop eating McDonalds and refuse to exercise.

[This message has been edited by kypper (edited 06-20-2002).]

Random Female
06-20-2002, 12:42 AM
melancolia's right; it ain't gonna fly. (no pun intended!) it'll get to the supreme court and they'll strike it down.

my beef is this: I am 5'2, weigh 115. On my trip home from china i was UNCOMFORTABLE AS FUCK. if little me is uncomfortable and cramped, how do the regular people feel? Then when i landed in san fran and changed planes to san diego, the seats were MUCH bigger and i was totally fine. so they fucked me on the 12 hour flight and on the 45 min one i was fine. they need to make the seats bigger period.

kypper
06-20-2002, 12:48 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Random Female:
melancolia's right; it ain't gonna fly. (no pun intended!) it'll get to the supreme court and they'll strike it down.

my beef is this: I am 5'2, weigh 115. On my trip home from china i was UNCOMFORTABLE AS FUCK. if little me is uncomfortable and cramped, how do the regular people feel? Then when i landed in san fran and changed planes to san diego, the seats were MUCH bigger and i was totally fine. so they fucked me on the 12 hour flight and on the 45 min one i was fine. they need to make the seats bigger period. </font>
You had a shitty plane. Every time I've flown, I've had tons of room.

Random Female
06-20-2002, 12:50 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
You had a shitty plane. Every time I've flown, I've had tons of room.</font>maybe so. i thought US airlines was supposed to be good, tho.

Mark LeDrew
06-20-2002, 01:08 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by sawdust restaurants:
I guarantee you this will be found to be in direct violation of the ADA.</font>

Now what does the American Dairy Association have to do with it?



------------------
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/mledrew/kid.jpg

I hope you know a strong man who can lend you a hand lowering my casket.

kypper
06-20-2002, 01:13 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Random Female:
Originally posted by kypper:
You had a shitty plane. Every time I've flown, I've had tons of room.</font>maybe so. i thought US airlines was supposed to be good, tho.



US Air sucks... But they should have good room, you're right. A standard of a certain width should come into effect.

Mr. Rhinoceros
06-20-2002, 04:16 AM
<font color=#007AAA>As a fat man who does not take up two seats, I think this is totally fair.

------------------
Sometimes I think I'd be better off dead. No, wait, not me, you.

Lie
06-20-2002, 02:32 PM
Well, it makes sense that they should have to pay for two seats. Otherwise the airline will lose money in order to accomodate them, which isn't fair.

But obesity, is, in almost all cases that are that extreme, partially genetic and partially psychological, and a definite disorder.

FearFactory
06-20-2002, 04:12 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Mr. Rhinoceros:
<font color=#007AAA>As a fat man who does not take up two seats, I think this is totally fair.

</font>

<font color="Orange">SELLOUT!
</font>

Houdini
06-20-2002, 04:16 PM
i like fatties sitting next to me. theyre so soft and cuddly! i just rest my head on their heavy layer of flab and go to sleep

Graveflower
06-20-2002, 04:16 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
Which is fucking pathetic. It is not your right to have other people suffer because you can't stop eating McDonalds and refuse to exercise.

[This message has been edited by kypper (edited 06-20-2002).]</font>

There are very few people like that at all. I don't know if you were exaggerating for effect or you really believe that. It's a constant struggle, I don't know of many people who are content and don't try to do anything about it, including myself.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 04:45 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
It is when it means that that's one less ticket in profit for the airlines because (most) of these people haven't gotten their weight under control by living a healthier lifestyle.</font>

how is it fair for these companies to determine how a person should live their life? in some cultures, obesity is respected, and is not considered gross. I was put onto medication for depression which made me gain weight. I am now 5'4 and 150... now, I know that this wouldn't affect me, but from the standpoint of a person who knows what it's like to feel like shit because of the way I look...I really empathize with the people this would affect. it's horrible.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 04:46 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
As well they should.
Obesity can be controlled; if you require 2 seats, then you pay for not correcting your health issue.</font>

easier said than done, and some people are obese because of an uncontrolable health issue (hypothyroidism for one)... how is it fair for them? answer: it's not. make the fucking seats bigger...but don't make your passengers, your paying fucking customers feel even more like shit.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 04:48 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by SPZero:
thats how it should be! I dont want someone with more rolls than a bakery on me the whole flight.</font>

then don't fly- i'm sure fat people don't like being treated like they're horrible people because of how they look. I can't believe a board that is normally so liberal can be so cruel about this issue.

kypper
06-20-2002, 04:50 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by melancholia:
easier said than done, and some people are obese because of an uncontrolable health issue (hypothyroidism for one)... how is it fair for them? answer: it's not. make the fucking seats bigger...but don't make your passengers, your paying fucking customers feel even more like shit.</font>

Well there is a limit to which we should go to accomodate those outside of the norm, especially if we are losing extreme profit due to it. A little bit of a seat englargement is fine, but I'm sorry - I don't think I should have to pay for extrodinary circumstances, and that is exactly where it is coming out of: THE AVERAGE PERSON'S TICKET PRICE. Make everyone else suffer so that you don't have to take responsibility; that's what the country is all about.

[This message has been edited by kypper (edited 06-20-2002).]

melancholia
06-20-2002, 04:51 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
Which is fucking pathetic. It is not your right to have other people suffer because you can't stop eating McDonalds and refuse to exercise.

[This message has been edited by kypper (edited 06-20-2002).]</font>

wow, you have just fucking become the only person here i really can't fucking stand. why do you assume that obese people are lazy slobs? has it ever occured to you that some people actually have medical conditions that make them heavy? not everyone is able to dedicate a lot of their time into losing weight...and i sure as hell dont' want a fucking industry to dictate what is and what is not an acceptable weight for me or anyone else... the ADA will not let this happen.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 04:53 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
Originally posted by Random Female:
melancolia's right; it ain't gonna fly. (no pun intended!) it'll get to the supreme court and they'll strike it down.

my beef is this: I am 5'2, weigh 115. On my trip home from china i was UNCOMFORTABLE AS FUCK. if little me is uncomfortable and cramped, how do the regular people feel? Then when i landed in san fran and changed planes to san diego, the seats were MUCH bigger and i was totally fine. so they fucked me on the 12 hour flight and on the 45 min one i was fine. they need to make the seats bigger period. </font>
You had a shitty plane. Every time I've flown, I've had tons of room.

well, not everyone is a spoiled fucking brat in first class. get over yourself, prick. when i was 115, i've been on flights where the seats were small. the fucking airline industry tries to pack people in there as much as they can so they can make the all mighty dollar. no one gives a shit about customer satisfaction or comfort anymore. the truth of the matter is, most planes, the seats are so small that even a 120lb person is uncomfortable... they'll lose even more fucking business than they are now.

kypper
06-20-2002, 04:53 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by melancholia:
wow, you have just fucking become the only person here i really can't fucking stand. why do you assume that obese people are lazy slobs? has it ever occured to you that some people actually have medical conditions that make them heavy? not everyone is able to dedicate a lot of their time into losing weight...and i sure as hell dont' want a fucking industry to dictate what is and what is not an acceptable weight for me or anyone else... the ADA will not let this happen.</font>

Excellent. Take offence without considering the other side. Yes, there are many people who do work hard, and yes, there are those with medical conditions. But it can be overcome to the extent that one seat will fit most of these people so long as they put forth a little common sense in terms of healthier eating and some regular exercise.

"and i sure as hell dont' want a fucking industry to dictate what is and what is not an acceptable weight for me or anyone else... "

Well, I'm sorry, but there needs to be a line drawn, and the government, not the industry, will do it in the end. If it is a case of being selfish to the way you want to live, then that's fine, but you have to expect consequences.

kypper
06-20-2002, 04:55 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by melancholia:
well, not everyone is a spoiled fucking brat in first class. get over yourself, prick. when i was 115, i've been on flights where the seats were small. the fucking airline industry tries to pack people in there as much as they can so they can make the all mighty dollar. no one gives a shit about customer satisfaction or comfort anymore. the truth of the matter is, most planes, the seats are so small that even a 120lb person is uncomfortable... they'll lose even more fucking business than they are now.</font>

YO! I'm not screaming at you, nor am I insulting you; get over yourself. I have NEVER flown first class. Not once. Maybe Canadian planes are better suited to their passengers, but just keep your rude fucking comments to yourself.

Graveflower
06-20-2002, 04:57 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by melancholia:
then don't fly- i'm sure fat people don't like being treated like they're horrible people because of how they look. I can't believe a board that is normally so liberal can be so cruel about this issue.</font>

I've noticed that absolutely nobody seems to care how they're hurting someone over this issue.

kypper
06-20-2002, 04:57 PM
Oh, and just so that you all know I'm not an anal hypocrite, I'm going on a run. http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/tongue.gif See ya.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 04:57 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by kypper:
Well there is a limit to which we should go to accomodate those outside of the norm, especially if we are losing extreme profit due to it. A little bit of a seat englargement is fine, but I'm sorry - I don't think I should have to pay for extrodinary circumstances, and that is exactly where it is coming out of: THE AVERAGE PERSON'S TICKET PRICE. Make everyone else suffer so that you don't have to take responsibility; that's what the country is all about.

[This message has been edited by kypper (edited 06-20-2002).]</font>

who the fuck is the AIRLINE INDUSTRY to say what the hell "morbid obesity" is. What are they fucking going to do, ask your weight and size when you book plane tickets. That's a violation of personal privacy. I'm sure that heavy people are not very comfortable with flying, especially knowing that they'll be looked down upon and all kinds of assumptions will be made about them... making this a reality will just worsen their situation, which WILL (in a country like the USA where a majority of people are obese) put the airline out of business.

Graveflower
06-20-2002, 04:59 PM
To be fair, the problem is if a person takes up too much room for one seat, and therefore that one seat cannot be sold. The airline isn't just going to say "hey, you're fat, you have to pay for an extra seat, tubby."

I really only thing this should apply to flights where the flight is near, or at capacity, because if this happens on a flight with 20 empty seats, they really aren't losing a sale.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 05:01 PM
Listen, I'm really sorry for being such an ass about this- but it's a really sensitive issue with me right now... and I really don't think that people should be treated like cattle. We come in all different shapes and sizes... and it all boils down to what a person is comfortable with... I can't see how it would be legal to make people *who are physically disabled* pay extra money because of their size. The seats should be enlarged to fit pretty much everyone... and for those select few who will not fit, then give them a seatbelt extention and don't make a bad situation worse for them.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 05:06 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Graveflower:
To be fair, the problem is if a person takes up too much room for one seat, and therefore that one seat cannot be sold. The airline isn't just going to say "hey, you're fat, you have to pay for an extra seat, tubby."

I really only thing this should apply to flights where the flight is near, or at capacity, because if this happens on a flight with 20 empty seats, they really aren't losing a sale.</font>

that would be a really good idea, except for the fact that they would have to know ahead of time everyones measurements... obese people would be baared from standby flights, sudden flights, and holiday flights...unless they are finantially capible to pay the extra money. i still would object to that, because i can understand how horrible that would make a person feel... if you think about it, this would really only apply to a selected few people- but i'm sure that eventually, BMI would be calculated in with your plane ticket in order to fly... that's just unfair, and sad that we've come to this. Odds are, if you're going to fly- you're going to fly with someone of a "normal" size. If you find yourself uncomfortable sitting next to an obese person, understand that they really do have a problem, and wait until the flight is boarded to see if you can get another seat... but transportation is a need for pretty much all of the population. people shouldnt' be singled out because of their weight.

kypper
06-20-2002, 05:11 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Graveflower:
To be fair, the problem is if a person takes up too much room for one seat, and therefore that one seat cannot be sold. The airline isn't just going to say "hey, you're fat, you have to pay for an extra seat, tubby."

I really only thing this should apply to flights where the flight is near, or at capacity, because if this happens on a flight with 20 empty seats, they really aren't losing a sale.</font>
One last comment, and I'm sorry for offending you both, because I honestly respect that it can be medical, and I know that it's difficult to stay in shape, especially if you have a predisposition to it... I would have to agree with you, Sean, and I was thinking that before... when it hits capacity is the time at which it's a problem. Perhaps when you apply you should just have to specify whether you need one or two seats? That avoids measurement problems.

melancholia
06-20-2002, 05:13 PM
Thanks for being cool this time man, I dont' hate you anymore...and that is a good idea that wouldn't offend people. I guess what really ticked me off is how it seemed that you thought that obese people do it to themselves (and yes, they play a role in it) but it's a very hard condition to deal with...

So very sad about me
06-20-2002, 10:34 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Graveflower:
To be fair, the problem is if a person takes up too much room for one seat, and therefore that one seat cannot be sold. The airline isn't just going to say "hey, you're fat, you have to pay for an extra seat, tubby."

I really only thing this should apply to flights where the flight is near, or at capacity, because if this happens on a flight with 20 empty seats, they really aren't losing a sale.</font>

It says they would issue refunds in the article

I agree with you...

And to whomever says its unfair.... think about it. they provide a service. if you need 2 of whatever items are being sold, then obviously you should have to pay for 2 of them. i don't know how they would inforce it, but in cases of extreme obesity, it should become obvious who does need it.
also, something i'd never understood, why would morbidly obese people not want the comfort of 2 seats??? Why would they want to feel embarrassed at taking up half of someone else's seat and making them feel uncomfortable.
They should save themselves and the other person the hassle, and get the 2nd seat

ill effect
06-20-2002, 10:57 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Mr. Rhinoceros:
<font color=#007AAA>As a fat man who does not take up two seats, I think this is totally fair.

</font>
</font>

oh, by the look of your pictures, you'll be in two seat territory very soon.

ill effect
06-20-2002, 10:58 PM
p.s.

does this mean that the fatty in question gets two meals also? they paid for it. i'm sure they would argue to have it.

Anti-Moan Gestapo
06-21-2002, 12:09 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by ill effect:
p.s.

does this mean that the fatty in question gets two meals also? they paid for it. i'm sure they would argue to have it.</font>

Valid point.

Although my girlfriend did this once, stole my dinner while I was sleeping.

Mr. Rhinoceros
06-21-2002, 06:32 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by melancholia:
I am now 5'4 and 150.</font>

<font color=#007AAA>Noting wrong with that. Nothing wrong with that at all.</font>

<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">well, not everyone is a spoiled fucking brat in first class. get over yourself, prick. when i was 115, i've been on flights where the seats were small. the fucking airline industry tries to pack people in there as much as they can so they can make the all mighty dollar. no one gives a shit about customer satisfaction or comfort anymore.</font>


<font color=#007AAA>Now you're just turning me on.

------------------
Sometimes I think I'd be better off dead. No, wait, not me, you.

[This message has been edited by Mr. Rhinoceros (edited 06-21-2002).]

kypper
06-21-2002, 07:30 AM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Anti-Moan Gestapo:
Valid point.

Although my girlfriend did this once, stole my dinner while I was sleeping.</font>

I hope you made her puke it up!
<font color="black">

[This message has been edited by kypper (edited 06-21-2002).]

Lie
06-21-2002, 04:06 PM
<font face="Arial, Verdana" size="2">Originally posted by Graveflower:
I really only thing this should apply to flights where the flight is near, or at capacity, because if this happens on a flight with 20 empty seats, they really aren't losing a sale.</font>

That makes sense. I was coming back to this thread ready to bitch someone out, but it looks like the hostility has resolved itself.