View Full Version : mellotron


skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:27 PM
on which parts of siamese dream did the band use the mellotron??

Caine Walker
08-23-2007, 05:28 PM
jesus christ, you ARE bored.

i_adore_adore
08-23-2007, 05:30 PM
It's in every song. Every second of every song. Sometimes you just don't hear it, though.

TRUST ME.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:31 PM
jesus christ, you ARE bored.

haha, yeah it's true. But no, i was looking at this: http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/GForceMTron-main.html and thinking about getting it. Just made me wonder how it was utilized on sd...

waltermcphilp
08-23-2007, 05:34 PM
the mellotron is a myth. anyone who tells you that it was on siamese dream is a liar and is not your friend.

the sellout
08-23-2007, 05:35 PM
tis pretty heavy on Mellon Collie; but i'm not sure they used it on SD at all, at all.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:35 PM
i knew billy corgan was a liar and not my friend, but now you have confirmed it. :(

waltermcphilp
08-23-2007, 05:36 PM
i'm sorry you had to find out this way.

Anvil Hands
08-23-2007, 05:37 PM
Spaceboy has the Mellotron going on. And Prolly Luna.

Hey Skipgo isn't a Mellotron exxpensive ?

I have always dreamed of getting one along with a Moog and a set of Moog Taurus Basspedals. All that Analog stuff rocks !

Anvil Hands
08-23-2007, 05:38 PM
Hell Yeah Rick Wakeman is up on that page :)

skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:39 PM
tis pretty heavy on Mellon Collie; but i'm not sure they used it on SD at all, at all.

really? i was thinking about that part in vieuphoria where billy's talking about people screaming or whatever. yeah.
anyway, considering the list of bands who've used mellotrons, i'm sure i've heard plenty, but i'm not sure what parts of the songs are the mellotron.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:40 PM
Spaceboy has the Mellotron going on. And Prolly Luna.

Hey Skipgo isn't a Mellotron exxpensive ?

I have always dreamed of getting one along with a Moog and a set of Moog Taurus Basspedals. All that Analog stuff rocks !

'tis a bit ironic, to use an electronic sample of an analog sampler. but much less expensive, and takes up no space in my living room to boot!

tyguy666
08-23-2007, 05:42 PM
really? i was thinking about that part in vieuphoria where billy's talking about people screaming or whatever. yeah.
anyway, considering the list of bands who've used mellotrons, i'm sure i've heard plenty, but i'm not sure what parts of the songs are the mellotron.
i kinda think the screams were edited in as a joke. i saw another interview where billys presses the keys and theres no noise, because at another part where billy rubs that pedal board theres no noise but they added in the squeaky noise.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:43 PM
holy crap what a dumbass i am, there are quite clearly audio samples on that page i linked to. 'doh!
but still, i'm interested in sp's use of this lovely machine.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 05:45 PM
i kinda think the screams were edited in as a joke. i saw another interview where billys presses the keys and theres no noise, because at another part where billy rubs that pedal board theres no noise but they added in the squeaky noise.

oh yeah, i didn't mean that i thought he really used those screams, i just remember that in the interview when they talked about using the mellotron.

billy looked like an overgrown 12 year old i that interview, btw.

david_bowiez
08-23-2007, 06:05 PM
Spaceboy^

Sam Vimes
08-23-2007, 06:08 PM
The M-Tron VSTi rocks. Love it.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 06:26 PM
i might just have to get it :)

smashkin33
08-23-2007, 08:13 PM
what about the mutron bi-phase?

i_adore_adore
08-23-2007, 08:14 PM
What ABOUT the mutron bi-phase? HUH!?

smashkin33
08-23-2007, 08:15 PM
well what tracks did they use it on!??!

i_adore_adore
08-23-2007, 08:17 PM
all of 'em.

waltermcphilp
08-23-2007, 08:21 PM
well what tracks did they use it on!??!

you know that one that goes "ba ba ba ba BA BA ba ba BAAAAaaa!" and then david cassidy starts singing. you know?

i_adore_adore
08-23-2007, 08:22 PM
I love that song

brendo_91
08-23-2007, 08:42 PM
all of 'em.

this isnt too far off the mark actually, if you listen closely.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 08:43 PM
I THINK I LOVE YOU!!!!

what about that guitar with all of the sad tones? where did they use THAT? hmm?

skipgo
08-23-2007, 08:47 PM
this isnt too far off the mark actually, if you listen closely.

i'm actually quite interested in finding out some stuff from you.... i'm just getting started with this whole recording thing (haven't really done any since using an old tascam 4 track cassette machine about 10 years ago), and would be interested in some tips from someone who knows about this stuff. I'll probably send you some PMs about this sort of thing eventually :)

werideatdusk
08-23-2007, 08:50 PM
of course they ran the mellotron through the Mutron Bi-Phase!

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v45/strummersteve/mutron.jpg

"We run everything through it. Everything."

brendo_91
08-23-2007, 08:52 PM
first use of phaser on SD that i can think of is billys clean guitar at the start of cherub. and they basically don't turn it off from there.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 08:53 PM
i love every single little sound on SD. every one. I love you, Mutron Bi-phase.

exactlythesame
08-23-2007, 10:16 PM
first use of phaser on SD that i can think of is billys clean guitar at the start of cherub. and they basically don't turn it off from there.

I like the fact that it's subtle, unlike most bands who use a phase pedal. It actually creates more of a chorus sound, which makes for the nice, fat clean tone. Gotta love it.

Also, the mellotron shows up in the title track on MCIS, but it's not anywhere else that I can think of.

brendo_91
08-23-2007, 10:41 PM
there's also mellotron on Lily.

exactlythesame
08-23-2007, 10:55 PM
there's also mellotron on Lily.

crap

you're right

skipgo
08-23-2007, 11:28 PM
how can you tell? what is it about the mellotron that makes it recognizable?

exactlythesame
08-23-2007, 11:31 PM
how can you tell? what is it about the mellotron that makes it recognizable?

It sounds like synth strings, but way cooler.

brendo_91
08-23-2007, 11:44 PM
Well on Lily, it's actually Mellotron Oboe.

On Autumn Nocturne I think there's some Mellotron Flutes.

Analog/crunchy/lofi/raw/fake sounding. Plus, if you're using a real Mello, notes can't be held for longer than.... i think it's 8 seconds, so if you're playing a slow pad, you have to keep moving through the notes of the chord to keep your chord from ending, so there's an actual playing technique that's pretty unique to the mellotron.

Listen to MCIS (the track). First you get the strings, about a minute in, then about a half a minute later, the oboe comes in.

If you listen to Lily, it's just the Oboe sound.

Also there's a very Mello-heavy version of MCIS the track around... I think from Sequence IV. And I seem to recall hearing a version of Tonight Tonight with mello?

exactlythesame
08-23-2007, 11:45 PM
Well on Lily, it's actually Mellotron Oboe.

On Autumn Nocturne I think there's some Mellotron Flutes.

Analog/crunchy/lofi/raw/fake sounding. Plus, if you're using a real Mello, notes can't be held for longer than.... i think it's 8 seconds, so if you're playing a slow pad, you have to keep moving through the notes of the chord to keep your chord from ending, so there's an actual playing technique that's pretty unique to the mellotron.

i've never played one, but it sounds pretty neat. it's one of those things that sounds so fake it's cool.

skipgo
08-23-2007, 11:51 PM
Well on Lily, it's actually Mellotron Oboe.

On Autumn Nocturne I think there's some Mellotron Flutes.

Analog/crunchy/lofi/raw/fake sounding. Plus, if you're using a real Mello, notes can't be held for longer than.... i think it's 8 seconds, so if you're playing a slow pad, you have to keep moving through the notes of the chord to keep your chord from ending, so there's an actual playing technique that's pretty unique to the mellotron.

Listen to MCIS (the track). First you get the strings, about a minute in, then about a half a minute later, the oboe comes in.

If you listen to Lily, it's just the Oboe sound.

Also there's a very Mello-heavy version of MCIS the track around... I think from Sequence IV. And I seem to recall hearing a version of Tonight Tonight with mello?

thanks for the details brendo, this is exactly what i was looking for when i started this thread :)
I'll go back and listen to these sounds to get a feel for it. I heard on that sample on the m-tron page i was looking at earlier that the start of "strawberry fields" is a mellotron. Very cool, I've always loved that bit.

brendo_91
08-23-2007, 11:57 PM
heaps of mellotron from that point and after in the beatles catalog, yeah.

also, per wilberg from opeth used (sampled) mellotron flutes on "hours of wealth" - download that song if you can find it, it's nothing like their usual death metal songs. there's a bunch of sampled mellotrons on their damnation album too, played by steve wilson of porcupine tree.

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 12:04 AM
http://ftp.rspaa.niluje.net/sp1/Demos/Sequence%20IV/Sequence%20IV%20-%2001%20-%20Mellon%20Collie%20And%20The%20Infinite%20Sadnes s.mp3

http://www.rspaa.org/data/Demos/Sequence%20IV/

Take a listen to Tonight, Tonight as well, and the version of Lily there has the mellotron over in the left speaker which might make it easier to pick.

smashingdreams
08-24-2007, 12:26 AM
here's my attempt at a serious answer if there hasn't been one:

spaceboy is the only SD track with mellotron (the orchestral sounds)...luna and disarm were real strings.


there is much more mellotron on mcis - obvious ones being mellon collie, galapagos, and here is no why (listen closely during/after solo i believe)


the beatles first used a mellotron on strawberry fields forever (first few notes, on the "flute" setting)

ok that's all i know for sure.

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 12:32 AM
Ah yes - galapagos, in the middle, at "and tell me", and then the outro.

i don't hear it in Here, though.

It's also very obviously on the track "Infinite Sadness".

skipgo
08-24-2007, 12:40 AM
this has been pretty enlightening. I've just downloaded m-tron from oink to give it a test run, I'll pay for it if i think i'll end up using it. i wish i didn't have to work tomorrow so that i could spend the day playing with it.
Mellon Collie and the Infinite Sadness is a lovely tune... the perfect opener.

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 12:41 AM
just to clarify when i mentioned "infinite sadness" in my last post i dont mean track 1 of MCIS.

skipgo
08-24-2007, 12:45 AM
yeah, i figured :) i haven't heard "infinite sadness" in ages.

Lyric
08-24-2007, 01:00 AM
lol. skipigo, when i first read the subject of this thread i thought you had played on "megatron" from transformers...

then i just find out it's about that wierd piece of equipment billy seems to like.

lol..... i'm laughing at my stupidity so hard

smashapumpkin
08-24-2007, 01:03 AM
i love the beatles' use of the mellotron

skipgo
08-24-2007, 01:07 AM
lol at that, lyric!

i just started playing around with this software version of the mellotron, and I gotta say, it's pretty impressive! it will be even more fun after i get myself a midi controller to use instead of pressing keys on my laptop. Still, very intuitive and sounds fantastic!

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 01:10 AM
how big was the download, my ratio's shit at the moment.

i usually just start with normal sounds and then fuck them up so they sound mellotronesque...

smashingdreams
08-24-2007, 01:44 AM
i don't hear it in Here, though.


it is really hidden in there but i believe it doubles the melody during the solo and then you can definitely hear it at the "then you're giving..." part (2:59).

a nice, subtle addition.

redbreegull
08-24-2007, 03:39 AM
Um, so, forgive my ignorance but I have never really understood what this thing does. The Mellotron is like a sampler, right? So when we are talking about mellotron oboe or mellotron flute, or mellotron orchestral noises, or mellotron screaming, or we talking about program individual sounds in for each note and then playing it like an instrument? Uh.... dur

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 05:09 AM
it is really hidden in there but i believe it doubles the melody during the solo and then you can definitely hear it at the "then you're giving..." part (2:59).

a nice, subtle addition.i believe you're hearing electroharmonix microsynth in the solo, and just a bunch of guitars man. i'd be very surprised if what you're pointing out is mellotron, it just sounds like microsynth and a whole stack of overdubbed guitars. and microsynth is a guitar effect, just to be clear.

Um, so, forgive my ignorance but I have never really understood what this thing does. The Mellotron is like a sampler, right? So when we are talking about mellotron oboe or mellotron flute, or mellotron orchestral noises, or mellotron screaming, or we talking about program individual sounds in for each note and then playing it like an instrument? Uh.... durthe mellotron is a tape based sampler. you have a little tape in there and when you press the key down the tape comes into contact with a playback head and the tape rolls.

its the precursor to the keyboard as we know it today.

skipgo
08-24-2007, 08:33 AM
how big was the download, my ratio's shit at the moment.

i usually just start with normal sounds and then fuck them up so they sound mellotronesque...

i think it was about a gig and a half.
i could upload it to my webhost for you today if you'd like. I'll have to start uploading before i leave for work, maybe it'll be done by the time i get home for lunch.

redbreegull
08-24-2007, 08:34 AM
i believe you're hearing electroharmonix microsynth in the solo, and just a bunch of guitars man. i'd be very surprised if what you're pointing out is mellotron, it just sounds like microsynth and a whole stack of overdubbed guitars. and microsynth is a guitar effect, just to be clear.

the mellotron is a tape based sampler. you have a little tape in there and when you press the key down the tape comes into contact with a playback head and the tape rolls.

its the precursor to the keyboard as we know it today.

So say I want to play Mellotron oboe. Do I have to sample an oboe note into the mellotron for each key? Or I am just thinking incorrectly here?

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 09:39 AM
i think it was about a gig and a half.
i could upload it to my webhost for you today if you'd like. I'll have to start uploading before i leave for work, maybe it'll be done by the time i get home for lunch.

I'd need a mac version anyway. but thanks for the offer.

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 09:40 AM
So say I want to play Mellotron oboe. Do I have to sample an oboe note into the mellotron for each key? Or I am just thinking incorrectly here?

there is a separate tape loop for each key, yes. however, i believe the tapes were able to be changed, and it came from the factory with different sets of tapes. i have no idea, but you dont have to record in each note every time you want to change sounds.

skipgo
08-24-2007, 10:15 AM
I'd need a mac version anyway. but thanks for the offer.

good news for you; i'm a mac user :)

selection7
08-24-2007, 06:34 PM
Skipgo, what is this software and samples you have that recreate the mellotron impressively? I've been curious about how to get that sound for ages (digitally)...and I do have a midi keyboard to make use of it...though I'm a windows user.

skipgo
08-24-2007, 06:51 PM
i'm not sure if it's cross platform, but it's gmedia m-tron. Here's a link:
http://www.gmediamusic.com/gforce/m-tron/M-Tron.html

i was just playing around with it, and hitting a few notes of "choir" in the tape bank, it was pretty apparent that it was the same sound as in the beginning of TEITBITE. so i opened that up in itunes and lo and behold, it was identical. So add TEITBITE to the list of songs :)

brendo, i had a hectic lunch hour, so wasn't able to up it. I'm starting it now though, i'll let you knw when it's up. Any other mac users here are welcome to grab it before i take it down in a day or two. :)

selection7
08-24-2007, 07:19 PM
thanks. seems like it's exactly the sort of thing I was interested in.

smashkin33
08-24-2007, 07:22 PM
im gonna be honest here. i thought billy was BSing when he mentioned the mutron biphase.

redbreegull
08-24-2007, 07:33 PM
im gonna be honest here. i thought billy was BSing when he mentioned the mutron biphase.

Listen to his voice on Siamese Dream. Closely. Do you hear how there is a slightly processed sound to it? That's the mutron biphase. Although I don't think I hear it on his voice in Disarm.

DeviousJ
08-24-2007, 07:45 PM
Listen to his voice on Siamese Dream. Closely. Do you hear how there is a slightly processed sound to it? That's the mutron biphase. Although I don't think I hear it on his voice in Disarm.

It's probably on all of them - listen to the version of Mayo on Still Becoming Apart, that's just the studio version with a bunch of layers (like the heavy guitars) removed, and you can hear how much phaser has been spooned onto the vocals and the guitar, but it's not obvious in the final version because of everything else going on around it (and that's why there's no phasing on the quiet bit in the middle). It's done to make the different elements sit together better, makes the mix clearer

brendo_91
08-24-2007, 10:10 PM
phaser and the 'pumpinizer' patch he and butch made up, for the eventide.

Q. Is that Jimmy's reverb or --
A. That I'd have to go -- I'd have to listen, but you can pretty much hear the basics over the rock stuff. It's just a really good drum and bass sound. The guitar is just sitting there and it was -- It's always been kind of hard to mix my vocals, because they just cut thru everything.

Q. I was going to say -- You said you found Butch and you found sort of a pocket for them --
A. Yeah. We would run them a little low and that's when we started -- it became to be known as the pumpkinizer, the special effect of my voice that we all know and love.

Q. Is that like an exciter or anything like that?
A. No. It's more of a pitch change program, but it's not -- It's just a subtle pitch change. It just pitches around the voice.

There is tons of biphase all over SD though.

Professor Fox
08-25-2007, 05:39 AM
Tony Banks of Genesis best exhibits the potential of the mellotron.

Anvil Hands
08-25-2007, 03:28 PM
Tony Banks of Genesis best exhibits the potential of the mellotron.


Plus rep to you.

Genesis has the best keyboard sounds ever ! Tony Banks really had his shit together.

Their live albums really kick ass.

Martyr
08-25-2007, 04:21 PM
Mellotron = always great