for the mpeg video (a convert of the Real Media file - not the best quality, but servicable) go here:

http://portfolio.iu.edu/shallmar/Zwan_-_Honestly_[VCD_Agamemnon_RiP].mpg

to give credit where its due, I got it the link from the Z-board at
http://mb.zwan.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi?s=3e1d2a7206bbffff;act=ST;f=1;t=8370


as for my thoughts on the vide: honestly, its a little bland.

the shots from underneath were actually pretty cool, but that's the only visual aspect that I enjoyed. The "floating in stars" stuff was pretty cheesy. Too many shots of the band smilling and having fun - not that fun is bad but it realllllyyy comes off as forced (even if it was genunie, it pushes it over the top). Also, there's one part at the beginng of the 2nd verse that just has the entire band just SITTING there with the camera slowly panning around - defintely NOT what you wanna do in a rock video.

It basically just screams - "THIS IS NOT THE SMASHING PUMPKINS" and for an introductory video to a new band it does the job -- still a little too over-the-top for my tastes. There's a fine line between a "fun" video (ie. 1979 or Today) and cheesy, I feel this crosses it.

but, hey, that's just me, maybe y'all love it.

on 2nd viewing, though, I do like the camera work in the room where they're all performing (the blue filter at the beginning is really nice) and the last shot is pretty funky -- but the cheese factor is a little high in this one. and is it just my imagination but on the overhead shots people are jumping up and down in a circle around them. WTF? "One of us! One of us!"

I like the video a lot.

you know, i never really liked honestly until i watched the video.

it's fantastic. i dunno why - it's full of cheesy stuff, but it just seems right.

AH, thanks for the link, I couldn't get the MTV one to work.

Wow I don't think I've ever seen so many smiles out of Billy in one sitting :D

One thing I do like is that they aren't all dressed up, I mean they're wearing clothes that you would see them wear at a concert...in fact I know I've seen the elephant sweater before!

Some of it is horrifically cheesy like when Jimmy looks into the camera, but it's really good and seeing it has made me smile. <3 Zwan

you motherfuckers. you hyped the cheese in that video way too much. personally i don't think it was that bad, i was expecting a lot worse after the bitching and moaning i've heard (not just in this post). but yeah, there was some cheese, but i'm not embarrased to watch it or anything. overall descent, in fact, better than any machina video.

Originally posted by Ugly

It basically just screams - "THIS IS NOT THE SMASHING PUMPKINS" and for an introductory video to a new band it does the job

thats exactly what this video is.

I really like it. Billy + Paz singing at each other, the rest of the band in the backgr0und, all finished off with the windows starfield screensaver. Wonderful.

^^ that's exactly what i thought..."what's with the starfield screensaver???" heheh. The cuts of billy and paz singing to each other and billy smiling into the camera were a bit....uhhh...offsetting....but otherwise i really like it.


killed radio star- awesome sig. hilarious.

Thanks for the link. It is somewhat cheesy, but I like it. The big ZWAN logo made me laugh.

Billy has never been one for subtlety. Everything about Zwan right now is about distancing themselves from The Smashing Pumpkins. It screams GUESS WHO WE ARE NOT !

The T-Shirt, The band logo, the artwork, the first single, the video, the interviews (which takes occasional cheapshots at D'arcy & James).

I'm actually shocked their album is called Mary Star of the Sea because it has a ring/vibe too close to Mellon Collie & the Infinite Sadness era.

Anyways back to the Honestly Video.
Hits:
* Billy with a Flying V (Gibson ?)..it's not Strat but still.
* Shots of Billy & Paz singing at one another...gets cute points.
* Floorcam shots (cool effect even though it reminds me of an Incubus video for some reason...maybe the colors).

Misses:
* Various shots of Billy smiling....his smile looks like the smile of a pervert who got away with something plus it looks forced (look I'm no longer angst boy)
* Billy's weak "moustache". Rat in a cage indeed !!
* Zwan sitting around in a garden (?) talking about whatever...ok we get it your superfriends. They repeat this friendship theme sitting on a red sofa. YAWN.
* typical Jimmy shot (done with SP also)...you know the one, Jimmy playing the drums & looking back at the camera.
* Matt always looks like an outcast from the classic movie, Deliverance.


EVEN STEVEN:
* Zwan playing behind Microsoft Space Screensaver....it's OK I guess but then later on in the video horses galloping are interlaced in the scenes...huh ?
* Honestly is decent musically but the lyrics are pretty bad (I do like the line "I make a joke so you must laugh".

WTF PART:
Shots of the band playing in the circle, widens & there are people on the outside of the circle doing something or other but what I'm not sure (just rockin' out? playing instruments ?).

Also was there a shot of Paz playing the drums ?!? (it was quick so I can't be sure of it).



I actual like this song more when watching the video.....I guess it's just a fanboy reaction to seeing Billy in a video.

SP had a very strong history of really good videos SD era & after (even their Gish stuff at least TRIED to be artistic) but I guess Zwan is trying to seperate themselves from SP in video style also.

More proof to the fact that Billy has lost it. His creativity is gone.

Zwan is so full of homogony, that it isn't even funny. The part where he is singing face to face with that girl is just ridiculous. And the sitting around the table outside...what the fuck.

I'm so disillusioned. Why did you have to do this, Mr. Corgan. You were a god, and now your a pathetic human being. I used to think that you were up there with the likes of John Lennon. But his stuff after his amazing band was great. Some of it even better.

Through Zwan, it's obvious that you don't know how to get us back. Possibly through obscurity.

At least I still have my precious Pumpkins.

Originally posted by Fish
Some of it is horrifically cheesy like when Jimmy looks into the camera, but it's really good and seeing it has made me smile. <3 Zwan He looks back, and strikes the drum once. Very tacky.

Originally posted by In-Valid
Also was there a shot of Paz playing the drums ?!? (it was quick so I can't be sure of it).

It was just a weird camera angle... the camera was behind the drum kit (like, by Jimmy) pointing towards Paz. You see the drumming going on in front of her and you can't see her bass, but it's actually Jimmy drumming. You know what I mean? I think it was just an unfortunate angle...they should have editted it out.

I'm glad we've decided to write off Zwan already. You guys are pretty funny. :rolleyes:

Originally posted by killed radio star
you know, i never really liked honestly until i watched the video.

it's fantastic. i dunno why - it's full of cheesy stuff, but it just seems right.

ur sig is hilarious

its a great video.

its fun. energetic. understated.

I don't think it looks forced at all.

The only thing that i criticize with the editing is that Matt and Pajo's face time seams two seconds too short everytime.

Besides that ... it was a well done video that made me very happy

Originally posted by In-Valid

Misses:
* Various shots of Billy smiling....his smile looks like the smile of a pervert who got away with something plus it looks forced (look I'm no longer angst boy)
* Billy's weak "moustache". Rat in a cage indeed !!


LMAO!!!
you just made my day

The video is pretty gay, but it's also one of the most unique video's i've seen in a while. it will grow on me.

there is a split second shot where billy "adjusts" his nose. could be covering a coke addiction. look for it near the end, dont blink.

* The video goes along with the artwork and Billy's concern in keeping distance from his previous band.
* It is a bit homo.
* Looks like directed by an amateur director (a movie student, perhaps?)
* I want to believe that the band wanted the "special effects" to be ridiculous.
* The oposite from Billy's last video: tryx3.
* I'm not sure if it's aimed to catch new, mainstream audiences. I mean, a video similar to Vines' "Get Free" would be definitely a hit. But this mix of images...
* It's fun.

-AZVD.

Originally posted by In-Valid
(look I'm no longer angst boy)

Bingo.

It seems he's trying to do an image turn-around.



(edit: over quoted)

I love it. It fills me with glee. It puts a smile on my face.

I think this is the first band that has ever made me genuinely smile.

God bless Zwan.

I like the Video. It's fun. People bitching about Billy smiling is just retarded.

It's 10 times better than the Stand inside you love vid.

All of them dressed up in their long dresses and James slow motion shots with the violin bow.. IT MADE THEM LOOK RIDICULOUS. That looked forced.

Originally posted by dammit paul
in fact I know I've seen the elephant sweater before!

Check Hyperbole's pics from the Toronto show after-party.

Originally posted by In-Valid
...ok we get it your superfriends.

:D
Funneh.

Originally posted by In-Valid
* Billy with a Flying V (Gibson ?)Of course it's a Gibson. Billy ain't no po' boy.

And I think the video is pretty directionless conceptually, but who cares? That's the point. Who cares about making a good video when it's more valuable to have fun?

Originally posted by Justin_c12
It's 10 times better than the Stand inside you love vid.

All of them dressed up in their long dresses and James slow motion shots with the violin bow.. IT MADE THEM LOOK RIDICULOUS. That looked forced.

SIYL = MASTERPIECE

good video over all
im glad its got that whole "its not hte pumpkins" thing goin for it
but gotta say
the effects are oghey

but meh, that dosen't really matter, its jus an opinion

i'm sorry but SIYL sucked, it was an awesome song, with a terrible video. the sets were cool that was about it.

I like that honestly is just a video. Why the fuck would that song have a concept video anyway?


and critizing people for smiling is gay. although there are some gay moments in the video.

Originally posted by Hyperbole
Is it possible that it was supposed to be awful??

heh. :) Harsh.

I'm not thrilled with it, but I like the quality shots you get of the whole band (Jimmy most importantly).

there's nothing wrong with them smilling in the video -- but its EVERY . . . FRIGGN . . . SHOT! I mean, look at Paz *big dopey grin* "There's no place I couldn't be without you" cut to dancing them doing the electric boogie in outer space. and then horses run by. And then the superbestfriends stuff.

You can do fun videos, and even good performance videos but this is over the top and therefore the cheese factor kicks in.

oh and Stand Inside Your Love and The Everlasting Gaze video school this one. Now The Everlasting Gaze is a visceral performance clip -- I'm not saying Honestly should be like that at all, but Honestly is a very slow video for a very upbeat song, which is a minus.

It could be gayer... my friend adam could be in it.

OH SNAP on my friend adam. even though he'll never read this.

...:(

Originally posted by machinaddict


SIYL = MASTERPIECE

go back to the oboard

This video is a receipient of the coveted MJL Seal of Approval.

It takes the "band playing in a room for no apparent reason" cliche and drags it into a deeper quadrant of hell. The "space" scenes are offensive to the eyes.

Originally posted by Affect
More proof to the fact that Billy has lost it. His creativity is gone.

Zwan is so full of homogony, that it isn't even funny. The part where he is singing face to face with that girl is just ridiculous. And the sitting around the table outside...what the fuck.

I'm so disillusioned. Why did you have to do this, Mr. Corgan. You were a god, and now your a pathetic human being. I used to think that you were up there with the likes of John Lennon. But his stuff after his amazing band was great. Some of it even better.

Through Zwan, it's obvious that you don't know how to get us back. Possibly through obscurity.

At least I still have my precious Pumpkins.


"honestly" almost makes "window paine" and "everlasting gaze" tolerable.


I agree with those that think "mary star..." is a piss-poor SP title imitation.

how about we just throw a bunch of random junk together,
and make it so that every shot lasts less than 3 seconds, using video effects from the 80s?

fuck, nsync aren't even this happy.

It's interesting to see some of the people give the stock "you've written them off already" answer to every form of criticism, as if a single they chose to represent themselves with out of the gait, a video, and clips of the entire record aren't good enough for an early indication of what the band is all about. It reminds me a lot of the pre-Machina days, or for that matter, during that whole era when so many disliked what the band was doing yet couldn't have their opinion respected because so many said "wait til it's all over, it'll mean something."

Well, here we are, and it's the same thing all over again. Negative opinions of the material are still found to be either irrelevant or shelved away to be dealt with at a more convenient time by some. I haven't written the band off yet, but by all early indications, I can understand how some believe the project appears to be a disappointment, both on an artistic and aesthetic level, especially considering the potential that is present. I realize that Billy can do whatever he wants--he has proven himself to be one of the best artists of his generation, and he really has nothing left to prove--but this is no reason to dismiss criticism when an artist continues to release new material to be heard and considered. Some of the lyrics in these songs are beyond embarrassing.

And though I hope that those of us who are doubtful at this stage are proven wrong, I bet that nearly every person who says something to the extent of "you've already written them off this early" will say something like "you just don't get it" or, my personal favorite, "but it's supposed to be that way" once the album comes out later this month. Some day, maybe those excuses will catch up with themselves.

i'm still waiting for billy to come out and say "it's a joke", that what they're doing is intentionally gay, and that somehow that's the point.
Then he'll act like it's an achievement because it's so out of character. A respectable musician not affraid to laugh at himself? wow.
it seems all they do is laugh at themselves.


either that, or billy's been a depressed musician for so long, that he wants to check out what's on the other side.
I can imagine him thinking 'what if's during a pumpkins tour.
"what if we were a happy band, then we'd be famous"
But because he's been in an angst-ridden frame of mind for such a long time, his conceptions of the other side are over-exaggerated, and it's bad pop.

watch the video without sound. It's much better that way.

anyway, everybody has an opinion and most of them are wrong. what makes you think you're any different.

i feel so disillusioned

the video's certainly not bad, but it's not exactly in the realms of goodness either. i don't actually know what i expected though.

Hmmm. I didn't think it was horrible, but it wasn't the greatest. It reminded me of the type of video that a completely naive new band would make, and I guess they are a new band technically...I dunno. It could've been a whole lot better. At least it provided a nice comedic relief to my hectic day.

that was some gaytastic entertainment.

Originally posted by ******
I think this is the first band that has ever made me genuinely smile.

yes. :)

Originally posted by ava transformer
that was some gaytastic entertainment.

i agree with this post.

there should have been more guns in it

Originally posted by wangcomputers
i'm still waiting for billy to come out and say "it's a joke", that what they're doing is intentionally gay, and that somehow that's the point.
Then he'll act like it's an achievement because it's so out of character. A respectable musician not affraid to laugh at himself? wow.
it seems all they do is laugh at themselves.


either that, or billy's been a depressed musician for so long, that he wants to check out what's on the other side.
I can imagine him thinking 'what if's during a pumpkins tour.
"what if we were a happy band, then we'd be famous"
But because he's been in an angst-ridden frame of mind for such a long time, his conceptions of the other side are over-exaggerated, and it's bad pop.

heh funny how i had the same opinion when we were talking earlier..

what's with that chick always smiling? i think she's into me http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/icons/icon6.gif

Originally posted by Dead
I like the video a lot.

i like it fine the way it is


i wouldnt change a thing



.well...maybe the paz and billy singing all close together shots...

but i still like the video

This is a really stupid video, but it's entertaining.

Paz is really cute..but the face to face shots are really lame

Oh and the last shot of Billy where he smiles goofily and shrugs his shoulders..that made me cringe.

If and when this hits TV, it's gonna a laughing stock..if Billy's placing his chips on the power of this video, he's in for a world of hurt.

Originally posted by ZERO
what's with that chick always smiling? i think she's into me http://www.netphoria.org/wwwboard/icons/icon6.gif

DUDE NO WAY SHE WUZ LOOKIN AT ME :mad:

Oh man.

Too, too happy. Made me smile...but come on...heh.

i've watched it like 5 times and i can't figure out if i like it or not. :\

Only Mark LeDrew could support a band after seeing such a horrible video like that. Open up your fucking eyes..Whoever directed this will never direct another video. The idea was lame, and the execution was even worse. It really is that bad.

If you like this video, may I also suggest some gay porn.

it reminds me of the zepha song

Positive: Paz is fucking hot. Holy god.

Negative: Random shots of animals. What the hell. And the star shit bothers me too. Matt...lose the hat. Seriously.

Eh...........I still really like the song, but after seeing so many cool Pumpkins videos...this is a little disappointing. And I am aware that Zwan =/= Smashing Pumpkins.

you when bands make 2 videos for a song, cause they weren't happy with the 1st one..... please for the love of god make another

Originally posted by Eulogy
Matt...lose the hat. Seriously.


no way, one thing I like about this video is that its a video meant for MTV TRL 14 year old airplay and he's still wearing that stupid mesh hat . . .

I like the video a lot. In fact, I like the song more after seeing the video, and I guess that means that it does its job very well for me. I can't see the smiling being gay at all, to me it's all warm and friendly. And we all know that Billy often is like that.

What is all the junk about "rock videos"? We've seen so many rock videos, so many different concepts, everything with a fat label saying "ROCK VIDEO" has the danger of being over-clichéd.

My only complaint is the choices of Jimmy's drumming shots. There are a lot of parts in the song in which his drumming looks cooler.